John Gray

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O: Hello and welcome to Stellar Life podcast. I am your host, Orion. I’m very excited about the show today, about our amazing guest but also about the month of love. Yes, we are crowning this month as the month of love on Stellar Life podcast. Valentine’s day is around the corner; roses, jewelry, chocolates, gifts, and cards. If you’re in a relationship, you have high expectations. If you just experienced a break up, you’re probably really sad. If you are single, you are so confused you don’t know even what to do on Valentine’s day. To get some clarity around it, I brought you relationships experts and authors this month. They will teach you how to find a good relationship, how to keep a good relationship and how to keep it conscious, long lasting relationship that you will enjoy. You probably know our guest today. You know his name. You’ve seen him many times on the Oprah Show, Dr. Oz Show, Good Morning America. He’s written over 20 books but his most famous one was listed as one of the Top 10 most influential books of the last quarter century. That’s a big achievement. He will teach you about soulful relationships and how your hormones affect them and what you can do about it. Please welcome the author of Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, Mr. John Gray. Hello John and welcome to Stellar Life podcast. How are you doing today?
J: I’m doing great. Good to talk to you.
O: I just saw that you were drinking your superfood shake that makes you feel like a superman.
J: It’s good to get good nutrition. As a relationship expert, I talk about all the good relationship insights and skills. It’s equally important that we have optimal hormone balance and brain function. Otherwise, we don’t stay, if we put it in romantic terms, biologically capable of romance. People’s biology changes over time. We have to learn how to keep those hormones in balance so that we can keep the passion alive in our relationships. It’s not just relationship skills but it’s also good nutrition combined. Maybe we can talk a little about both those things.
O: Oh yeah, we will. I totally agree with you, especially because we live in this world where we are so exposed to toxins and chemicals. All day long, we have to take care of our bodies because when our body is not functioning, our brain is not functioning and when our body and brain is not functioning, we can’t have good relationships.
J: On practical terms, sometimes people don’t make the link. Let me just point that one out. If we don’t have the right nutrition, we don’t sleep well. Sleeping is everything when it comes to hormonal balance. If our hormones are out of balance, we’re stressed. When we’re stressed, because the stress is stress hormones, as soon as your body goes into a kind of fight or flight, there’s different stages of that but once your body is in fight or flight stress, for women, they have a different reaction than for men. But, for both men and women, something does happen which is blood flow stops to the prefrontal cortex of the brain. That’s where we can actually have compassion, that’s where our wisdom comes from, that’s where we can reset our expectations, and that’s how we experience patience and love and appreciation. In relationships, we need to have generosity, we need patience, we need love, we need unconditional love for ourselves and others. These are really important higher values and it takes prefrontal cortex blood flow, literally, to support that ability and we have that ability. We all get a glimpse of it when we fall in love. Falling in love is a little bit like a drug trip because the newness and the lack of history in a relationship makes it very easy to love someone unconditionally. If somebody’s late once, no big deal, late 500 times, it’s like, “Ugh, give up on that person.” That’s part of history. Then, there’s something called newness. No history produces a lot of serotonin in the brain. That’s the sense of well being and optimism and trust. What happens with newness, in the beginning of a relationship, is you get free dopamine. That’s like when you go on a vacation, you always ignite some of the passionate feelings. People go to hotel rooms, they go on vacations, and they have more sex. That’s because there’s a new environment. There’s something around and it’s new. Women put on new outfits, it’s exciting for them. New lingerie, even if nobody sees it, she knows it’s there and it just brings a greater awareness to herself, her sex appeal, her beauty as a feminine being. It is very feminine, attraction is our feminine power. To have that, when we’re stressed, we negate those abilities, our hormones go out of balance. I spent many, many years now working on an update on Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus. It’s now out. It’s called Beyond Mars and Venus. It combines the more traditional ideas that I was dealing with in communication, insights for men and women to understand their differences in a more positive light. This new approach we’ll talk about today centers around that for sure, but the terrain of relationships has dramatically changed in the last 25 years. Women, they know they’re equal with men. Men know women are equal with women. There’s always exceptions of course, but we can see a woman can do anything a man can do. Men can be great nurturers and homemakers and so forth. The line between the sexes has blurred. It’s almost like we’re the same, but biologically, we’re not. That’s very, very important hormonally. This is the theme of going Beyond Mars and Venus, it’s to realize that as we let go of traditional roles, traditional relationships where the man had one role and the woman had the other role, the new relationship we’re all formulating now, we can call, I call it, a soulmate relationship. Because it’s a relationship, people use that term a lot, it’s always synonymous with unconditional love, it’s synonymous with passion, and being in love. It’s everything that old relationships had for a little while but went away. That’s because there was always that sense of newness and no history allows these really positive feeling to come forth. That’s a soulmate relationship. A soulmate relationship is one where we have new skills and new insights, and greater nutrition so that we can provide in a relationship the emotional support our partner needs to express their authentic self and that we get the emotional support that we need in order to express all of who we are. This can only happen in a world of equality where women can express their masculine qualities and men can express their feminine qualities without judgment but unconditional. We see a lot of huge people taking on this way, on that way and so forth but this is a new freedom. In that freedom, we can also make a mistake. The mistake can be you go from way on your female side where your male side was repressed and then you got free. That freedom is newness. It stimulates, you know, take off your bras and be sexually free. Go out make a million dollars and have grown companies. This is women’s liberation. This is women moving to their masculine side which has been repressed. Men as well, we have our liberation which is follow your heart, the hero’s journey, do what you love, grow your hair out, be a musician, be an artist, stay home with your children. These are huge releases of freedom that we’re experiencing today at a much higher level than when I wrote Men are from Mars. With that becomes a higher potential for happiness and fulfilment but a whole new set of challenges and problems. That’s what I’m addressing in this new message Beyond Mars and Venus, in my new book.
O: That’s amazing. The link to your book is going to be in the show notes. What’s your definition of masculine versus feminine?
J: I love the question. That’s actually, I think, that might be the second chapter of the book. I first talk about how our roles are changing and the new stresses that we have in our lives. Then, I go into defining what is masculine and what is feminine. That’s very important. Before I define it, so they can come along and define it, I think it’s a biological definition. What we have between men and women, biologically speaking, a universal principle that’s true around the globe is that if a man is healthy, he has a libido, he has well being, he’s not depressed and he’s not angry. In those cases, he’s a happy guy, motivated, purposeful, meaningful life and vital. He has a vitality to him. His testosterone levels in his body will be between 10 to 30 times more than a happy, healthy woman. There, we can do biological tests and this has been done. When women are healthy and happy, men’s testosterone levels will be at least 10 times higher, quite often 30 times higher. One’s not better than the other. It has a lot to do with the man’s own genetic type. We’re all different but in than realm of we’re all different, unique, wonderful beings, we want to express that authenticity in our uniqueness to find our greatness. That’s all my message. But, in that realm, when you look at all men, basically, and maybe you’ve got the 5% exceptions where certain brain changes happen in the brain and identity is shifted, actually there’s a group of 1 out of 10,000 children that has both male and female organs. There are exceptions to everything. I’m talking about massive generalities that you can make because we know that if a healthy man will have at least 10 to 30 times more testosterone than a healthy woman. On the other side of this, a healthy woman will have, generally speaking, 10 times more estrogen than a healthy man. That is changing today as men get in their 50’s and 60’s. Their testosterone levels drop by 50%. This is average. It is not normal. It is not healthy. In indigenous tribes where they have a different lifestyle, men’s testosterone levels never drop. Their estrogen levels will rise but not even close to a woman’s. But today, you can get some of these 60 year old guys that are going to die in 5 years, their estrogen levels are higher than their wives.
O: Wow.
J: The reason I said they’re going to die in five years is because that’s the insurance companies are talking about. When men retire, if they stop doing work to keep their testosterone up, men have to work. So do women, to keep your testosterone up, you have to work. We’ll define what those qualities are that stimulate testosterone. But for men, a man has to keep working his whole life. It doesn’t have to be a job he doesn’t fulfill. He needs a more fulfilling job as his estrogen levels go up which is natural but his testosterone is not supposed to go down. That’s why in indigenous tribes, the older men become, the wiser he is because he has a natural, biological balance of testosterone and estrogen. It’s happening in all men, as they get older, their estrogen levels rise but the problem for men today is their testosterone levels are dropping as their estrogen goes up. My message is how can relationships, as well as good nutrition, keep a men’s testosterone up. That’s one of the qualities and behaviour that stimulates testosterone. I talk about 10 basics ones. I’m going to cover three now which is very simple. One is independence; whenever you’re on your own, you’re an entrepreneur, you’re doing your entrepreneur work, you’re on your own doing it to a great extent, it’s up to you. That’s going to stimulate testosterone in a woman, it will stimulate testosterone in a man. It’s up to me. Is that bad for a woman? No, that’s the whole idea. Women are expressing more independence. The feminine quality is basically dependence. There’s a part of me that’s dependent on my wife. It’s dependent on money. It’s dependent on friendship. It’s dependent. A little caveat in my book, my editor said, “Please John, call it interdependence. You’ll upset too many people.” Even though I’m saying as a man, I have a dependent side. I need love. We all have needs but somehow it’s easier for women who have, there’s so much baggage around the word being dependent on a man. That’s what interdependence is. It’s two people depending on each other. That’s a partnership. That’s a relationship. The feminine side of that is dependence. The male side of that is independence. What we want is for every human being and in a soulmate relationship supports your partner and yourself in expressing your independent self and your dependent self. The way that looks, practically speaking, is some people are just going to be more independent and some people are going to be more dependent. That’s their nature but they always have both. Whatever you’re suppressing, one side or the other, you’re going to be stressed. The stresses that women are experiencing today, I’ve been doing this 40 years, I see their stresses are very different. 40 years ago, I rarely heard women saying, “I’m overwhelmed.” They might be angry at men if they were stressed but they were not overwhelmed. This is a word that has come into play as women have gone too far to their male side. Relaxation is what brings you back to the feminine side. You see a whole industry has massively grown. Fashion continues to multiply for women because fashion is appearance, expression of mood, independence. It’s like my own uniqueness coming out. That industry has grown for women tremendously. Fashion, that’s a feminine quality. Also, spa treatments for example, think about you’re doing a spa, you’re completely relaxed and you let somebody take care of you. You’re completely dependent on them to do something for you. You see when a man goes too far to his dependent side, he becomes an alcoholic, he becomes a drug addict or he becomes a control addict where his well being is dependent on his wife always being agreeable to him. That’s when men go too far to their female side. They’re tyrants. They demand that everyone bow to them. People don’t realize it, but that’s actually a man on his female side.
O: It’s very interesting because when I look at tyrants, I never thought of it as being a feminine trait.
J: See, the interesting thing about it is we’ll come back to testosterone, the male hormone, estrogen being the female hormone, that women have more of than men. When you look at testosterone in the past, it still hasn’t caught on everywhere but Stanford did the verification of this study that I’m about to talk about. It was always testosterone was associated with violence and aggression. A big testosterone guy is going to be aggressive. The chances of somebody being aggressive is greater if he happens to be a man who’s well being depends upon 30 times more testosterone. It has a lot to do with your muscle mass. The more muscle mass you have, generally speaking, you have a greater tendency, if you don’t have confidence, to be aggressive and violent. You go to the jails and you’ll see the violent criminals often are very muscular. Not everyone, there’s the mad scientist too. It’s a general kind of theme that that’s the case. You have a high testosterone guy. Actually, testosterone’s effect on a man’s body is causing him to feel cool, calm, and collected. Right now, my testosterone doubles doing this show. You can measure. Ride my body.
O: You’re welcome.
J: Testosterone goes up, you’re cool, calm, collected. You’re actually centered, you’re considerate, you’re more generous. All the best qualities that humanity come out when a man’s testosterone levels are at his normal level. What happens is when a man goes into fight or flight, he loses confidence, then his testosterone will shoot too high. At that point, he has superhuman powers to be cool, calm, and collected. That’s when people say they were in an accident, times slow down, they became completely peaceful. I’ve been in that situation. You make fast manoeuvres. I’m thinking your testosterone peaks. However, when testosterone goes really high and you lose your confidence, you lose your cool, you lose your centeredness, you disconnect from this part of the brain, the prefrontal cortex of the brain, when you disconnect and a fight or flight happens, then what happens in a man’s body is testosterone, this wonderful hormone that does all good things for men, converts into estrogen which when it’s in the right balance with testosterone is wonderful but when testosterone levels are converting to estrogen, that means his masculinity is going down, his femininity is going up, that is anger, that is fear. This is when men misbehave. This is where men lose control. This is when men have no compassion. They have no empathy. This is where they make really wrong decisions. It’s when they’re feeling angry and afraid. What’s happened today is we have this whole movement for 60 years of feel your feelings and express them, the most destructive thing in all relationships for men to do. Not destructive for women if they learn how to do it, but for men, to encourage them to express their angers and their fears and become “vulnerable” in everybody’s eyes like that’s a big, huge thing, to share that with your partner, it kills the passion in relationships. It pushes the man to his female side which then pushes the women into her male side more. If there’s any attraction in the relationship, there’s a flip that takes place and now she’s even more overwhelmed.
O: Because there is no polarity.
J: That’s right.
O: There is no polarity so you have to keep the polarity in the relationship. When a man is more connected to his masculine side, then it allows the woman to be more connected to her feminine. Gives her permission because if not, she will take on the masculine side and then, you’re either going to have two men in the relationship or the dynamic is going to just flip and the guy is going to be more submissive and the woman is going to be more masculine. A woman that is more feminine in her core, and she takes on the masculine all the time, it makes her tired, it makes her overwhelmed, it just takes her breath away but not in a good way.
J: Nicely said. Right out of my book, too. Thank you. Those are all the symptoms of what’s happening today. What you just described is absolutely correct, but it can be a little abstract for people what does it mean for a man to be manly. What does it mean for him to be too far in his female side. Because if I’m washing dishes for my wife, or for my family, that doesn’t make me a woman.
O: No.
J: That doesn’t make her more masculine. That could actually make her feel more feminine if she was tired and I did that for her so she could do something she enjoys doing. The secret is, like one of my several daughters and they’re married, one of their husbands, she said they set up their duties. They were doing them and they felt good about it. But she was taking on more and she was getting tired doing the dishes, that was one of the things she took on. She’s doing the dishes and she starts to complain. He says, “Okay, I’ll do the dishes.” He starts doing the dishes and then he saw that his wife, as a result, had more time, she didn’t relax, she didn’t rest, she didn’t enjoy her life better because he did the dishes. Maybe for a few weeks that happened then she took on more responsibilities. Male side went right back into taking on everything. He is like, “Why do I even bother doing this if you’re going to still stay overwhelmed.” It’s like there’s no right way for couples to be except in balance within themselves.
O: Exactly.
J: That’s the key that we want to look at. People are saying who should do this and who should do that.
O: It doesn’t matter.
J: It doesn’t matter. That’s what you work out and particularly you work it out in the beginning of the relationship where you tend to have no history of feeling resentful or ripped off or whatever, but coming back to this basic dynamic of needing support and being independent where I don’t need support. Women today get confused because they don’t want to go turn back the clock to feeling that part of them which needs help. Actually, that’s the feminine side of both men and women, is that we need help. You can’t have partnership without mutual need, without mutual desire, and without mutual preference. These are three aspects in every relationship. If I need sex, there are a lot of women who could give me sex, but there’s not a lot of women that are going to be my preference, the one I really, really like, the one I really, really need and the one I really, really want. That’s lining up souls and biology and so forth so it’s not like just anybody can be a relationship partner, but you can fail in any relationship if you don’t understand the new pressures that we’re under which is what I’m saying here. I hope we’ll have time to talk about nutrition but on the biological side, we need certain behaviours to assist each other in finding balance. The most powerful way to do that, maybe even the only way to do that, is through intimate relationships because I know the peak experience that most people have glimpsed making love, the union of bodies and spirit and heart and mind. The ecstasy of coming one with someone. I have been married to my wife for 31 years and we’ve always experienced a great degree of that, almost every time we have sex. But to feel that now with a hug, we’re not moaning and screaming but to hug my wife, I hug her maybe six times a day, coming and going and give her kiss and say I love you, to feel the connection of a six second hug, six seconds is when you can actually measure a significant hormonal change occurs in both bodies if you have that connection. You basically just connect back to I connect to my own female side through connecting with her with unconditional love. She connects back to her female side as I’m connecting to her, while also in touch with her masculine side by appreciating my love and my support. My love and support, when she receives it, that makes my testosterone go up. It makes her estrogen go up to find its balance point. If you can balance just like that, if you have that connection which is why we’re kind of crazy when we’re in love. It’s like a drug because of that newness, but you can sustain that over time in waves. It’s not always going to be the same. Nothing is the same, the weather is not the same. Again, that’s one of my big, big messages in the new book. It’s to recondition men to recognize what their role is in terms of a soulmate relationship. It’s actually very similar to, but very different from the traditional role of the man. Once we went into the 60’s, this role between, a man in a relationship shifted from men being provider, as women become more independent, than men providing happiness to the woman. I just want to make her happy. The reason we want to make her happy is because when she’s happy, we feel successful. The real need for a man on a man’s side is to feel successful. That’s a testosterone producer. Anytime I did that, that’s my independence, it’s also my problem solving side, so that’s the second aspect of masculine side. He says, “Oh, problem? What am I going to do solve it?” What would be the female balance to that is for a woman’s point of view of the female side, not a woman but a female side is to nurture. When you problem solve, usually you prioritize, you negate, you break it down, you fix. It’s something that a problem has to be fixed.
O: Very logical. Very left brain.
J: Yeah, very left brain. You have a situation where problem solving, in the context I’m talking about, it always going to produce testosterone. I’m fixing that toaster. It’s a problem. I’m going to fix it. Then, there’s something which is very feminine, which is similar, you have to have clear discernment here. It’s called nurturing. You see, nurturing is not fixing. You don’t fix a baby, you nurture it. You don’t fix your digestion, you nurture it. You don’t fix a plant, you water it, you protect it but you’re not fixing it. If something breaks, the plumbing breaks, you fix it, you don’t nurture it. Different hormones get produced when you’re nurturing someone. Estrogen goes up. When you’re fixing something, testosterone goes up. This is measurable. These are like our male, female, qualities and really, the work world is all about fixing to a greater extent, solving problems. One of the biggest problems in the workplace is getting customers, making money, paying the bills, achieving the goals. These are big stresses for everybody. We are all stressed out in the economy. We have the worst economy. It’s abundance everywhere but it’s a terrible economy. People are working long commutes and hours of work and changing this and not feeling enough time.
O: Overworked, overtired.
J: I grew up in the 50’s and it wasn’t like this, at least for some people. Now, for everybody, it’s just a really crazy, stressful time. Part of that is the life we create. We create our lifestyle to a great extent. To a great extent, there’s power over us and so forth but we have the power and that’s my message, to find the balance within ourselves. We have the power so even if you’re not living the totally abundant life you like to live, you’re happy and you’re stress free. It’s choices that we make. My message here is that women, if they don’t know how to come back to estrogen land, then they keep making choices for solving problems. The brain just goes into automatic. You actually have to make a decision that I have these certain five activities I can do that will stimulate estrogen so when I’m overwhelmed, what do I have to do in order to stimulate estrogen?
O: What do they have to do? What does a woman need to need to do to connect to her female side?
J: Okay, we’re getting there. These are hard to grasp ideas. I got to lay their ground work. It’s a complete paradigm shift. The most powerful thing, I’ll just answer your question, the most powerful thing a woman can do to return to estrogen is to find a man, and it can be a woman but I’m talking about the most powerful, find a man and say, “Look at me. Ask a few questions. Don’t give any solutions. Don’t say anything. Don’t feel bad. Don’t try to feel empathetic. I don’t need anything except a sounding board. I want to express whatever I’m feeling inside and I just want you to listen.” What she practices during that time is expressing what she normally doesn’t tell anybody. It’s got to be intimacy. Intimacy is what creates estrogen. It means, I’m going to share with you what I don’t share with anybody else. Every woman goes to work and she doesn’t share with everybody at work what she thinks of them. She doesn’t share with everybody at work what’s frustrating for her. If you were to say, “Oh my God, this is so frustrating for me.” People go, “Oh, I guess she can’t do the job.” You can’t share what’s disappointing to you. These are real human emotions that have become like numb. People don’t let themselves feel them. There’s disappointment. Any single woman, everyday, on some level, she took a deep breath and got quite as disappointed that she’s alone. She’s frustrated that the guys are not what she wants if we look in terms of the dating situation. She’s concerned that she’s not going to find the right guy. Everyday, those feelings are there. But once you say to them, “I did that.” No, they come up just like you take a breath. It’s the same oxygen going in and out. Those feeling are there but you’ll sound like a whiner, you’ll sound negative. You sound like a victim, whatever, so you don’t share and you go numb to it. It sits in there. Because it builds up inside, then you find reasons to justify having those feelings. Your brain is getting hyper vigilant to look at everything that’s negative in your life. What I have to do instead of I don’t want to do that. I can get help. Until you let go of the idea of independence, that you have to do it all, your brain is not looking for what is the help. Your brain doesn’t prioritize what is most important, how can I not do that. It’s like these are qualities they have to develop. The way you develop it is by being on your male side then coming back to your female side by going to someone and feeling, this takes a while to feel it, that I really need to talk to somebody. You have to feel it. You don’t express estrogen until you feel I really need something. I’m really hungry. Go without food. Your estrogen levels will go up. Deprive yourself of something so you actually feel I need something and then express. That’s the first step, feel it then express what you feel. Not concepts, “Oh, I feel like nobody loves me.” No. “I feel concerned nobody loves me. I’m afraid I’ll never be loved. I’m scared of opening my heart. I’m starting to date. I’m going to open myself to the wrong person that are going to hurt, steal for me.” These are real fears. Women experience them daily yet they don’t come home and talk about them. Because what’s the point, in their mind. Because their male side is saying what’s the point of talking about feelings. There’s no point to it. For a man, there is no point to it although they’re being taught there’s a point to it by psychology.
O: So confusing.
J: There is so much confusion. Just to clarify that point you just made, that there’s so much confusion. I was confused 30 years ago. As a marriage counselor 30 years ago, I heard women saying, “I wanted to be in his head. What’s he thinking? What’s he feeling? I want to know.” I got men. I trained men to use the “I feel” statement. It drove women crazy. I’m not saying he should never share but he should always hear her way more than she should hear him. What I discovered is after getting men to driving women crazy, women were saying, “Gee, I didn’t realize he had so many problems. I don’t even want to get married to him. I didn’t know he had so many problems.” Another one would be, “He’s so sensitive. I have to walk on eggshells.” Another one would be, “Gosh, I feel like he’s a child. I love him but he’s like a child. I hurt his feelings so easily. I feel more like a mother. How can I be turned on to a child?” It literally changes her hormones to be in the presence of a man who needs her help. Now, some little hormone changing is fine but when a man needs a woman’s help more than she needs his help, she now starts making more testosterone. She also makes another hormone called vasopressin.
O: What’s that?
J: Vasopressin is a hormone that in men causes them to bond with women. Men do not bond with women unless they have vasopressin. They don’t get turned on to women unless there’s some vasopressin. There needs to be plenty of dopamine, plenty of testosterone and then vasopressin comes up and he bonds with the woman. He wants to make a commitment to her and men who can’t be monogamous are men who have a lot of vasopressin. You can feel vasopressin just by how you relate to each other which is basically the scenario is if you were to exaggerate it, and it give it some characters, it’s the knight in shining armor and it’s the damsel in distress.
O: Right.
J: Whenever a man is around, he’s the knight in shining armor and she is the damsel in distress. He is the hero and she needs his help. It’s doesn’t have to be she’s this powerless woman, it just means she needs help. Women today as strong as you think you are, you need more help than ever before. That’s the good news. What you need help for is not to do male things, you need help to come back to your female side and men can provide it if they learn how to do it and women learn what they need and they ask for it. That’s the whole thing because men don’t know this. Men are good giving the opposite messages today. Be more feminine. Share your feelings. She complains about something, you complain back. I teach men never complain to a woman. There’s no point in ever complaining to a woman. Because when you’re complaining, you’re whining about your own female side, get over to your male side. If you want to complain which I’m going to my men’s group tonight, I’ll go there and complain. When you’ve got complains with other guys, you’re talking about other situations, guys will laugh with you. You’ll make jokes about it. You don’t go like, “Oh, feel sorry for me.” All this whiny stuff when men lose their masculinity then they seek out sympathy. When women lose their femininity, they don’t seek out this sympathy and empathy which helps them get back to their estrogen side. I’m not saying you stay only on your female side.
O: No.
J: That’s something you can misinterpret. It’s finding the balance. If you’re going to go extreme to super woman empowerment, women get it done, make money. You don’t need anybody for your survival, security. You’re a Karate champ Kung Fu master, millionaire woman. You are not sleeping at night. You are not happy at night unless some guy is making it safe for you and you’re opening up to him being there for you to help you. That’s the whole key to this thing. It’s to come back to finding a place in the relationship where your feminine side can thrive in the most powerful way. Romance is another one. You ask how women can get back to their estrogen side. Clearly, it’s the male, female thing. If you’re planning to date and doing everything for the man, it’s not romantic.
O: No.
J: But if the man plans everything and you have a good time, it’s very romantic. But how is the man supposed to know because you’re always changing. He doesn’t know what you need. He doesn’t know what you like. You’re waiting for him to know because he knew a few things and it was all new and different so really, whatever he said was romantic. But after a while, that goes away. How do you find that romance is you have conversations. Those conversions are a week in advance, you talk about, “Hey, next weekend,” for people that work everyday, and then have time off on the weekend, “let’s discuss what we can do together. This is what I would like to do.” You’re the woman talking. You don’t do what he likes to do. Give up the idea that romance is doing what a man wants to do. Women are so up to what would you like to do? What would you like? Oh, it’s not about what he likes to do. That’s not romance. Romance is when he does what you like to do. But here’s the counterforce, you don’t want to tell him what to do because that’s not romantic either. What you do is you say, “Here are some things I’d like to do. Would you pick one and organize it and let me know?” Boom, it’s all back in his hands. He’s in control. He gets to take credit for. He now knows his information and a request for him to use that information to plan a date and let you know the next day what he decides. He’s the decider. But does she feel controlled and disempowered by that? No, because his decision is taking her need in consideration as a priority. It’s just a win-win situation. Nobody does it. They don’t understand these dynamics. It’s just like, “Well, I don’t want him to decide.” Or women do, “I want him to decide.” So she’ll say, “What do you think? What should we do?” He’s going to go, “Let’s go see a Rocky movie.” “Let’s go see a terminator movie.” “Let’s go watch Dr. Strange.” No. That’s not going to be romantic for her. It’s romantic if it’s what she wants to do. Women who are deluded, basically, when they’re immature you shouldn’t say deluded because immature, when you say, “What do you want to do?” What she wants to do is anything he wants to do. That is not connecting with your female side. Your sense of self is dependent upon pleasing him.
O: Right.
J: That’s low self esteem. You need to find your happiness without depending on pleasing him just as men, and I’ll get back to this, one of my big messages for men, is how men have to recognize our happiness, yes if I make my wife happy that does make me happy. But, I am the source of my happiness, that’s an extra bonus. It’s not my job to make her happy. My job is to make her safe.
O: Relationships are much better when each one of us is taking care of our own happiness because when we are happy, we can communicate better, we can relate better. I want to circle back to what you said about dating because we are getting closer to Valentine’s Day and there are a lot of single women out there that are looking for love and are dreading Valentine’s Day. I remember when I was single, that was one of the worst days of the year. I did not like Valentine’s Day. How can a woman find her anchor, her security, self love, and almost prepare for that day?
J: One preparation for that day is get a boyfriend. I want to first talk about that and then I would do what she can do if she doesn’t have a boyfriend on Valentine’s Day. The first thing is lower your standards. Stop looking for your soulmate and look for a positive dating experience. Stop looking for a husband and start creating and generating a flow of men in your life and positive dating experiences. Basically, we put too much pressure on ourselves and somebody else to be the one. Then, we’re desperate and we’re vigilant. Now, we’re going to be judgmental. I see these dating shows where you get, “Let’s not waste time. Let’s get to the point. Are you dating material for me? How many children do you want? How much money do you make? What’s your job?” Forget about all that. Start creating lack of loneliness in your life where you’re feeling I’m fulfilling my life and I’ve got a man in my life. And I can do this. I can practice all these new relationship skills. You can’t practice being a tight rope walker when you’re walking over the Grand Canyon. You need nets. It’s like, couples, they’ve got a commitment but they’ve got a history, so the more challenging for them. But when you’re single, you can practice all of this stuff, easy. Lift the burden. Stop feeling it’s such a hurry. The clock’s ticking for some women. Once you start relaxing into relationship, you’ll connect to your female side because there’s nothing you’re afraid of because you’re not making a commitment to anybody right away. You relax in your female side, your female side knows who’s right for you. Your female side will attract the right person for you. But if you’re eager trying to please somebody, you’re way on your male side. You’re trying to get them to like you, get them to love you.
O: There’s a goal.
J: Yeah, you got that goal and you’re on your male side. You’ll attract all the wrong guys. You’ll attract either needy guys or guys who basically just want a one night stand, and that’s it. They’re out there. They don’t know they’re capable of making a commitment either because their vasopressin, their testosterone is low. They need a good woman to share her femininity with them. They will find the vasopressin and find the testosterone if the match is right for them. The complement to vasopressin which is this hormone that causes men to bond with women, it’s a hormone that turns men on, is necessary for men to experience real ecstasy in sex with a woman. If a woman experiences vasopressin, it’s proven that it shuts down her sexual desire. That’s the biological explanation of what we discussed earlier. When men are too far on their female side, women start to feel disconnected, more masculine, and often that shows up as either overworked, overwhelmed, doing problem solving, or feeling like she’s a mother to him and nurturing him but from a mothering perspective and not a nurturing of equal relationship. It just turns her off. She can’t feel sexual desire. So many women don’t. You cannot feel this sustained passion for a man when your female side is not there. All of your emotionality is on your female side. That’s what emotions are. Whenever you’re in touch with your emotions and express them, your estrogen levels will go up. That’s why I tell men, if you’re upset, don’t express your upset at your partner ever. I mean ever. It’s the stupidest thing in the world. You’re throwing your hormones out of balance. It’s not productive in any way. Stop talking. If you can listen a little longer, that’s great and then exit. You’ve got to postpone stuff. If my wife upsets me, she can, I’m not saying men don’t feel your feelings. I’m saying don’t share them with your partner when you’re upset with them. I just simply say, “I hear you.” She know he’s going to go off. I’m going to go off and do something. I’m going to forget the conversation. I’ll forget it. That’s the whole key for men. Forget it. Don’t think about it. Don’t worry about it. And then do something to pop up your testosterone. Then you relax and remember what happened and be 100% accountable. That’s masculine quality. That’s masculine energy. It’s how did I make that situation worse. Problem solve, how could I make it better? What can I do to better show my love to her? Then go back and be loving to her. Done. Done deal. Then, she starts to trust that when he pulls away, he always comes back with more love. Then, she is relaxed in the relationship. As I mentioned before, the greatest gift a man can give a woman is make it safe for her to be herself. At the same time, we all have limitations as human beings. We have this monkey brain that’s programmed and conditioned that reacts to stuff. When a man feels criticized, just as when a woman feels criticized, defense reactions occur. This secret of learning, learning how to communicate, is for women to start sharing whatever is going on inside with their partner, with a man, ideally, if you can find a man, it can be a girlfriend, it’s just more powerful with a man. That’s because he’s going to be over in his male side, not saying anything. A woman’s going to be waiting for her turn to do it which is okay but it’s a different hormonal situation when a man is listening. Somewhat similar for women doing it. If you can get a guy, get a guy to listen. Comes back to your female thing that you would never share with even your girlfriends maybe or even with a guy for sure, and you’re going to share these feelings, these vulnerable feelings, negative feelings, things you wouldn’t normally share for about eight minutes then, in the last two minutes you’ll see all these positive feelings. I appreciate. I’m grateful. I know. Your wisdom comes forth. I appreciate. I’m grateful. I love. I know. Everything’s going to be fine. I can handle all. Thank you so much for listening. You’ve been great. Go in for a six second hug. Done. I call that venus talk. There are subtleties of course, to make it more powerful but that’s the basic idea. That’s how women can come back to their female side. We discussed a little about romance. There are some other things but those are the most powerful. If you’re dating, lower your standards, create a series of positive dating experiences to practice how to be feminine on a date. Being feminine on a date does not mean saying yes to sex unless the every cell in your body, mind, heart, and soul wants to have sex. If you have sex to please a man, he becomes less interested in you. Say it again. Men will deny this but look at how many men don’t call back? How many men don’t pursue? It’s because they got too much for free. Basically, he needs to earn it. He needs to get in there because he did some things that made you feel safe, to help you feel good, to make you feel like you don’t have to pursue him, but he’s pursuing you. That’s the dynamic that you want to go with. There’s no right time to have sex once again except the wrong time is when you’re doing it for him and not for you. Later on, when you’re married, certainly when you’re dating and you’re in a committed relationship, certainly sometimes, you can do it for him because he might have a stronger desire but not when you’re setting up commitment. You can make out. You can do a lot of stuff. It feels good. It feels good for yourself, but not because it’s pleasing him. Otherwise, if you’re not happy, a button goes off inside of him that says he failed and he will lose interest in you whether it’s conscious or not. We don’t want those moments of waking up the next morning and go, “What did I do?” They just go like that. Women have it?
O: Never. I’m just kidding.
J: We have needs. We all have needs. They need to be fulfilled but when you’re looking for creating a long term relationship, overnight sex the first time is not always the best thing, maybe sometimes it is. It’s just not a fast rule. The rule should be you feel pursued as a woman. You feel safe. You feel like you don’t have to earn love. Then, you’re really wanting sex. Then you’re body’s going to get the message that you enjoyed it. One of the tests I tell women, I said, “Okay, if you’re doing it because you enjoy sex, and you have sex and he never calls back, you can say to yourself, “Boy, I really love that. I did it for me. I don’t need him to call back.” That’s the right time to do it. It’s not a deal. I’m not having sex because now you owe me. That’s what men feel. Women go into it. We had sex and now you owe me. Men hear that and they go the other direction as well.
O: That is so powerful for a single woman to understand because many of them, especially when they get a little bit older, they come to a point of too much stress, too many expectations and they freak the men out. Like you said, they either become really submissive and they do whatever they need to do to make him stay with them but at the end of the day that’s not what men want. A man wants a woman who is connected to her feminine and has boundaries and self esteem.
J: You say it exactly right. That’s the truth. Also, another thing in the dating is my daughter, Lauren, has a website. marsvenus.com is my website but she’s half of it. She has great wisdom as well. One of the things she says to women is the opposite of what women think. Women think, “I’m going to listen to him. I’m going to ask lots of questions.” She says just the opposite. Don’t ask him a lot of questions. Let him be interested in you. That’s how he’s going to bond with you, by listening to you. Use the practice of TMI, too much information. That means just you have your own opinion about things but don’t be like argumentative about it. It’s just be flowing with the whole thing. He says, “Oh gosh, what about the election?” “Yeah, boy I thought this and this and this and this.” He goes, “Well, I thought this and this.” And then you always, if you have a difference with him, you say things like, “I get that. That’s a good idea. That makes sense.” And move along. This morning I was waking up and my cat said this and my dog said that. Men want you to fill out the space. Fill out the space with you and have opinions. Don’t just be opinionated. I remember when I was a weak person in the past, so many would say, “Did you like that movie?” I didn’t want to tell them what I liked until I found out whether they liked it. It was amazing. I said, “What’s going on here?” I’ll express my opinion and you can have your opinion. I don’t get upset that you don’t have the same opinion as me. That’s the place that really makes the man feel like, “Wow, there’s a person.” He can’t fall in love with a fake doll smiling and putting up make up all the time. You fall in love with who the person is. You shouldn’t have to work so hard to please him. But, good communication skills do help. One thing you can always say when a guy wants to have sex before you want to have it, or at what stage of it you want to have. You can simply say, “Oh, I go slow. I would love to go all the way with you. Every cell in my body would love to go all the way with. I just know I have to go slow. He go, “Really? But why?” You just repeat, “I just have to go slow but I’d love to.”
O: I love that. It’s beautiful.
J: He just needs to hear that you want it. That’s all a man wants to know.
O: So cool.
J: He doesn’t even have to have the act of sex, it’s just like yep, she wants me. It makes such a difference. Even in my marriage, that’s what we learned in my marriage. I say, “Honey, let’s have sex?” And she says, “Oh, I got to do this and this and this.” One day I said, “Do you want to have sex with me?” She goes, “Oh yeah, I’d love to have sex with you.” That’s all I needed to hear. Otherwise, I felt rejected. It’s just important that we have better communication about these things. What we need, what we like, what we want. The whole new book, Beyond Mars and Venus covers so much more than what we talked about but I’ve just got a few more minutes. If we can shift to nutrition for a moment, can we do that?
O: Yes, exactly what I wanted to do too because I’m very interested about what type of nutrition can help our hormonal balance, our wellbeing, our focus. Also, if you can go and talk a little bit about super foods that are aphrodisiacs.
J: The most important aphrodisiac for women is to relax because if you’re looping in your brain, and it’s not a food, the food would be beets. You won’t find that in any book, anywhere because these aphrodisiacs, for a time in the past, where women were too far on their female side, what we want to do is get them back to their female side. You see, everything has changed today, a lot of updates. These are new concepts. Beets don’t have enough anymore because they’re processed with pesticides and so forth. There’s an ingredient inside of beets which is called lithium. Lithium increases oxytocin. Oxytocin is the female version of vasopressin. Vasopressin causes men to bond with women. Oxytocin causes women to bond with men. It’s oxytocin in a woman’s body that also increases her estrogen and lowers her testosterone until her estrogen level reaches its right point. Once estrogen has reached it’s right point, when it really goes up, then her body can tolerate more testosterone. It’s like her body says, “Too much testosterone. I need to get back over to estrogen.” But if her estrogen can’t come up, then if she has the opportunity and the freedom to express her male side, her testosterone levels will come back up. What will increase her testosterone levels is an herb, just to get her body back in the mode, you don’t do this always but it’s just to wake up the sexuality. The lithium activates oxytocin and it creates more dopamine and more serotonin in the brain. It’s the cheapest supplement on the market. It has a complete misunderstanding which is because the psychiatrists give it to people with bipolar, they give a different form of lithium called lithium carbonate which you have to give toxic doses in order for it to work. For somebody who is depressed, they feel better. It’s the most important mineral for the brain but foundation where I live here in Marin County says it will prevent Alzheimer’s. It’s the cheapest supplement you can buy online. You can get three months supply for $11. It’s lithium orotate. They bond the lithium. If you go to any of the great spas in the world, they all have lithium in the water and sulphur in the water. The two building blocks of body for sulphur, brain for lithium. It relaxes the brain. It doesn’t give you low energy, it just relaxes the brain. A little bit of 4 ½ milligrams of lithium a day bonded to orotic acid which makes it lithium orotate. I encourage people to listen to the video on how to do it. It’s a bit longer in terms of why it’s good and so forth. That would be at marsvenus.com in the store. I have a health food store there. There’s lithium orotate. One of our biggest sellers is lithium orotate. Next biggest seller is tongkat ali. Tongkat ali also tells the brain to make more testosterone. If women have low libido, then tongkat ali will help bump up libido. Works best if they’re also doing the minerals so their estrogen stays up as well because you don’t want to have too high of testosterone levels if you’re a woman. That can lower your estrogen. And then, you can feel sexual desire but you can’t climax. You can feel waves of pleasure but you don’t really experience the full deal. That’s because you don’t have enough estrogen to do it. A woman’s body, I go into this cycle in a much greater detail in the book, but it’s in the five days around ovulation is when a woman’s estrogen levels double. That means her need for love and affection, attention, romance, touch, all those things dramatically go up. Her ability to have climax dramatically goes up but her needs have to be fulfilled. If during those five days, her needs are not fulfilled, then for the rest of the month there’s something missing in the relationship.
O: I remember you saying it.
J: I always schedule the dates during the five day window at least, a good day during that time. Lithium orotate is the key one. Tongkat ali is really good particularly for men but also for women to increase libido. If they’re also got their relaxed brain, which goes along with lithium orotate. I create a product called super minerals which has all the cofactors, calcium orotate, magnesium orotate, potassium and zinc orotate, those are necessary as well for lithium to do it’s full job. You can get the benefits right away if you just want to chest it out with lithium orotate but over time, you’ll need those co factors. Most women are low in magnesium. Epsom salt are just great to help bring your magnesium levels up. You can’t make serotonin unless your body has lots of magnesium. You saw me drinking my shake this morning. I had Parkinson’s 16 years ago so I figured out a natural solution for it.
O: No way. Wow.
J: Yeah. It was the same solution. It just creates optimal brain function. I was maybe using my brain too much which happens to people. You oxidise the brain with too much activity. Anyway, I was able to restore my brain with the super minerals and also amino acids. Amino acids are the building block of the brain along with good fats. You need amino acids to make dopamine, to make serotonin and to make GABA. GABA is falling in love. Serotonin is optimism and dopamine is focus and motivation and interest and passion. You want all those guys to go together. For that, you need the best protein. The best protein is mother’s milk. That’s what made the brain. I know many people can’t tolerate milk because they’ve been drinking milk which is pasteurized. I have a shake which is unpasteurized dairy and I take the fat out of it so it’s just the proteins. One for men and one for women because mother’s milk will actually have more of one protein for boys and more of the other protein for girls. More whey for girls. More casein for boys because we have a bigger muscle mass and more need for testosterone. I formulated my shakes according to mother’s milk to rebuild the brain and the hormone balance from those two different proteins. There’s no other shake in the world that even has both proteins in them. They only have whey protein which is the cheap one. Casein is often scene to be indigestible because it’s pasteurized but still, it’s hard to digest and people today do have compromised digestive systems. What I did is figure this out which is I put enzymes in it to digest it, added the minerals that are missing in our diet in order to activate the enzymes to digest the proteins. All you have to do is add water and let it sit for 45 minutes. You have to let it predigest. Nobody’s ever done this before.
O: Never heard of it.
J: Nobody have even heard of this. You digest it right there in the kitchen. It just starts bubbling. The difference in drinking it is so noticeable. It’s already a good drink before but it’s still kind of like heavy food. It just dissolves into your brain and your brain so much better relaxes.
O: Wow.
J: I had the Swiss laboratory to study it. What they said is if somebody takes any of these protein shakes or drinks or eats eggs or eats steaks or chicken, the body can only utilize about 30% of the protein. It breaks down about 30% into amino acids. That’s how much of simulation you get in the protein. The other 70% of the protein takes up 80% of the energy to eliminate it from your body. You’re getting such little energy from your proteins that you could only get as well as amino acids for your brain. They tested this and they found that it’s absorbed by the brain 92%.
O: Wow.
J: They’ve never seen anything. If you let it sit for 45 minutes. That’s the key to it. If you just drink it right away, it’s 30% like any other protein shake.
O: I want it and I want it now.
J: It is the most delicious because it has the casein in it as well. It’s called super food shake for women and then super food shake for men but to get the full benefit, you need to take the minerals before, just the mineral capsule so you get in those lithium and all the other co factors and then you let it sit for 45 minutes at room temperature. Nothing added to it. Just two scoops, add eight ounces of water and then let it sit 45 minutes. Then add about five to six cubes of ice and blend it up. It’s the most delicious milkshake. If you put four ounces, it’s the most delicious, cold chocolate pudding. If you like pudding. My wife likes the pudding.
O: Nice.
J: It’s amazing. This is mind blowing, reversed my Parkinson’s and it certainly keeps me at 65, keeps me young and vital.
O: Wow.
J: Definitely for me, my testosterone levels are 25% higher than I was a young man.
O: Wow.
J: That is standard for indigenous people. The average person my age and my male group, it’s half, it even goes below half. It’s basically because one is this role reversal which is taking place in retirement. I won’t ever retire. You have to have work to keep your testosterone up but more fun work. Because you got the estrogen that gives you the wisdom to do the things that are more enjoyable but you also have to put forth the effort of the male side. You’ve got to have the behaviour but you’ve got to have the nutrition to fuel the brain of all the dopamine and serotonin that it needs because it’s the dopamine that’s also a requirement for the testosterone and it’s the serotonin that’s the requirement for the estrogen.
O: John, thank you so much. I want to speak with you for hours but I want to be respectful of your time. I know you’re very busy. Before we leave, two questions. One, can you give us three super quick tips to living a stellar life and two, where can people find you?
J: The stellar life is single women on Valentine’s day, I want you to plan a date with a girlfriend if you don’t have a guy and you should go out and be proud that you’ve got friends in your life. Don’t be alone. Don’t leave yourself alone that night. If you don’t want to go out with a girlfriend although, “Hey, look I’ve got friends. I don’t have to have a guy.” That’s your independent side. Own it. If you don’t, at least stay home and watch some romantic movies with a girlfriend or a few girlfriends. Have a party. Schedule something because the collective consciousness is all making a big to do about it. You don’t want to be left out at that. Since having a stellar life is continuing to grow in your knowledge and your wisdom of how to love more, how to be loved more, how to be healthier, the understanding of what we need for health today. These are two key factors to have a stellar life that I see. Have your mission and purpose and go closer to it everyday. I know a lot of people don’t know exactly what that is yet but I’ll help you understand the female side and the male side. The female side of us and we want both, is to be happy. What do you need to be happy? The male side of us is how do you make a difference in people’s lives. As always, find ways to make a difference and also to be happy. Find that balance of both those things and gradually you’ll start arriving at your soul’s purpose which is where your greatness, where your genius, where your sense of okay, this is what I’m born for, it takes a while for most people but you’ll get there. How you can contact me more is at marsvenus.com. You’ll see a picture of myself and my daughter, Lauren Gray, who is also an expert on gender understanding and health and wellness and all that good stuff too. Those are free blogs that are available. We invite you to join us there. My new book, you can go to Amazon and get it and other online bookstores. Beyond Mars and Venus.
O: Thank you. Thank you very much, John. I really appreciate all the knowledge and I appreciate you and sending you much love. Thank you for sharing all this good information with us.
J: Thank you so much. My testosterone is rising.
O: Yeah, thank you.